Time: Mon Jul 21 16:11:34 1997 by primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA24121 for [address in tool bar]; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:54:51 -0700 (MST) by usr06.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA21043; Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:53:32 -0700 (MST) Date: Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:53:01 -0700 To: liberty-and-justice@pobox.com From: Paul Andrew Mitchell [address in tool bar] Subject: SLS: Manufacturer's Statement of Origin ("MSO") References: <199707211913.PAA07371@teaminfinity.com> <199707211913.PAA07371@teaminfinity.com> Excellent practical advice here. I just came from the Arizona Superior Court clerk's office, and the place is a bee hive of activity. Their workload must be astronomical. Caveat emptor!! /s/ Paul Mitchell http://www.supremelaw.com At 01:06 PM 7/21/97 -0700, you wrote: >I understand your frustration Ralph. We have all had problems >getting answers. > >I've had my best results with extremely short queries. Ask ONE >polite question, and then wait for a response. It is much >harder for your servant (or commerical correspondent, as the >case may be) to avoid a single question. Also there are >advantages to not revealing how much you know, or what direction >you might be headed in. One thing leads to another, you know. > >I would personally never try to explain anything to a >bureaucrat, just seek simple answers to simple questions. > >For example, you could start with "When I purchased >such-and-such vehicle the dealer sent the manufacturer's >statement of origin in to your office. What does the state do >with these things, and why do they want them?" Maybe your kid >is writing a report for school. Be creative, but brief. > >If the first query is ignored, try it again certifed. "Gee, my >last letter must've gotten lost in the mail...." > >You'll be amazed what you might learn if you have a little >patience. > >Of course, if you're good at it, there will come a time when the >friendly servant who once was responsive suddenly becomes stone >cold silent. > >That's when you get to play the tacit procuration game. > >Steve > >Mon, 21 Jul 1997 15:13:26 -0400 (EDT) Ralph <ralph@teaminfinity.com> wrote: >> >>I was not trying to be polite, I was trying to get some answers. There is >>not ALWAYS a direct correlation betwixt the two, but of course there can be. >>If the claims were that outrageous, then all the easier it should have been >>to refute them or dispense with them. No substantative response was >>received, what is your take on the situation, invective aside, just stick >>with the facts. What is your take on the certificate of origin regarding >>who owns the car based on who has possession of the certificate. Also >>realize that this letter was after many other UNANSWERED LETTERS, this one >>finally got some attention. The bottom line is why not address the QUESTIONS >>themselves and not continually come up with excuses and obsfucation galore >>and attacks on the question and JUST ANSWER the DAMN QUESTIONS !!! Remember >>these dufuses (for the most part) are supposed to be working for us !!! >>They are the ones who need to bend over backward. I will not grovel at them >>for answers to simple a*s questions, and after having written several >>extremely polite letters and not receiveing any answers at all I rachet up >>the tone. Do you know the answers ? Or are you just an arm chair general >>who can only offer trite comments and pontificate style that does not >>address the core issues. I do not seek uniformity of style, I seek truth. >>Please rewrite the letter as you would have it written and I will see if >>your letter engenders a better response, this effort on your part would be >>quite useful and to which I have no objections so long as it gets some >>answers without compromise. To not include tone when that feeling is part >>of the reality is to not give all the information regarding my request. To >>include all the information with my request for info and the fullness >>thereof, which includes the feelings towards the answers I suspect may be >>the case, will better enable the questionee to know which straw man needs to >>be knocked down, GABBISH ? We all need to stop trying not to see what the >>other person is saying and just communicate as best you can, and not mince >>words and succumb to the forest for the trees syndrome. you know what I was >>asking as did he. I appreciate the same brutal honesty back from those I >>ask brutally honest questions, not excuses or word mincing, when none is >>required. Make it plain, my tone leaves no doubt as to the nature of my >>question, or at least that is what I strive for. If you do not understand >>the question, please ask for more detail. If my assumptions are not >>correct, delineate exactly where they require change with proof. And lastly >>please do not waste our time with carping over style, if you have answers, >>make them known, otherwise please keep your editorial foibles to yourself or >>in a private email to the person who may need your editorial advice, thanks >>and I hope that this is the last on this subject (editorial OPINIONS), and >>again please make answers to the questions known if you have any, that is >>what most of us want I suspect. >> >>Thanks in Advance. >> >> >> >>> >>> Ralph <ralph@teaminfinity.com> writes: >>> > [...much deleted...] >>> > Oh thats right YOU (the state) own my car, now it makes sense, >>> > how dumb of me, guess thats why I am a peon, and the State is so powerful >>> > these days. Where are and what are the statutes governing this policy. >>> > [...much more deleted...] >>> > Respectfully, Ralph >>> >>> First, that closing is facially at odds with the tone of the entire >>> letter: The letter is beyond rude, to the point of simple insult. >>> >>> Second, did you get a response to it? >>> >>> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>> Unsub info - send e-mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com, with >>> "unsubscribe liberty-and-justice" in the body (not the subject) >>> Liberty-and-Justice list-owner is Mike Goldman <whig@pobox.com> >>> >> >>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >>Unsub info - send e-mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com, with >>"unsubscribe liberty-and-justice" in the body (not the subject) >>Liberty-and-Justice list-owner is Mike Goldman <whig@pobox.com> > > >-- > >Steve Washam Walla Walla, Washington sew@valint.net >----------------------------------------------------------------- > > Does a question provoke more thought than a statement? > >=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= >Unsub info - send e-mail to majordomo@majordomo.pobox.com, with >"unsubscribe liberty-and-justice" in the body (not the subject) >Liberty-and-Justice list-owner is Mike Goldman <whig@pobox.com> > > ======================================================================== Paul Andrew Mitchell : Counselor at Law, federal witness B.A., Political Science, UCLA; M.S., Public Administration, U.C. Irvine tel: (520) 320-1514: machine; fax: (520) 320-1256: 24-hour/day-night email: [address in tool bar] : using Eudora Pro 3.0.3 on 586 CPU website: http://www.supremelaw.com : visit the Supreme Law Library now ship to: c/o 2509 N. Campbell, #1776 : this is free speech, at its best Tucson, Arizona state : state zone, not the federal zone Postal Zone 85719/tdc : USPS delays first class w/o this As agents of the Most High, we came here to establish justice. We shall not leave, until our mission is accomplished and justice reigns eternal. ======================================================================== [This text formatted on-screen in Courier 11, non-proportional spacing.]
Return to Table of Contents for
Supreme Law School: E-mail