Posted by Greg Layton on October 08, 1998 at 01:00:26:
In Reply to: Re: Deeds REPONSE-Any experiences with Allodials? posted by Eldon S. Slangal on December 25, 1997 at 20:59:06:
HELP!! I need the name of the fellow out west--Please?: : : : : : : : : : Hope nobody minds my deleting the original question for expediency:: : : : : 1) If you provide your e-mail address, I'll e-mail: : : : : you directly with the name of a fella out west: : : : : that deals with this type of info..he's super: : : : : busy but knows about all the de factor vs de jure: : : : : instruments dealing with "property."I hesitate: : : : : to put his phone number/address out on inet w/o: : : : : his permission, etc. : : : : : Also: Surely some of these groups that deal: : : : : with allodials/land patents and such would probably: : : : : know. Search on these topics and some of these: : : : : groups are bound to come up.: : : : : Ann: : : : The search was informative. Thanks.: : : : Municipalities are perhaps raising the land patent: : : : issues at time of incorporation, and at all times: : : : subsequent in the event of annexations, thereby: : : : establishing their PARAMOUNT interest in the land: : : : under their "jurisdiction".Any additional pointers: : : : are always welcome. A YES vote in an annexation: : : : election, is perhaps akin to a feudal oath of fealty.: : : : Does anyone know.: : : : Property transfers that do not transfer the interest in: : : : the land patent, such as warranty deeds, deeds of trust or: : : : other instruments may only transfer the illusion of: : : : color of title, keeping the patent holder as the: : : : true owner, and entitled to his fief.: : : COMMENTS:: : : Good info on deeds..agrees with concepts of what I have also read on this topic.: : : The real question is: Does anybody have first-hand experience with actuallly filing: : : a land patent/allodial deed on their property and having it be "effective" with: : : the local taxing authorities? I've not heard of suceess story in Texas, although heard : : : (stories) in another state who supposedly got a "you're exempt" letter back from them...: : : wish I had kept details but cannot confirm. : : : My supposition is that it (may) help/at least delay with the "land grab", by "biospheres" : : : and "Heritage Rivers", etc. (per a land patent researcher I know)etc. : : : FYI: Just talked with a fella the other day (here in Texas) whose land had NOT been "rendered": : : but they found him anyway and put a lien on his property for not paying property taxes. He's: : : trying to work on obtaining allodial deed, etc. Any success stories..please tell us.: : : Obviously, my personal belief is that property taxes are the worse of all taxes, since: : : regardless of what "net profit" or "income" you have, or you citizenship status, so: : : those property taxes keep going up and up,and have nothing whatsoever to do with your: : : "cash flow." HOPE TO GET SOME MORE POSTS ON THIS TOPIC.: : : WHat's youre experiences..let us know...I'll share my experience: : : when I have them..good or bad. : : : Ann: : : : Try these for info. They're a little old, but: : include cites from as recent as 1985: : http://www.mm.mtu.edu/~pecampbe/action-allod1: : http://www.mm.mtu.edu/~pecampbe/action-allod2: : http://www.mm.mtu.edu/~pecampbe/action-allod3: : I'm just conjecturing as to the actual obfuscation: : that goes on. The county registrar's office has: : received a NEW (and improved) system of recording: : deeds etc. Involves computer imaging. On my first: : cut through the micro-fishe reels I managed to get: : back to 1960. Then the process get's harder....: : I am assuming that "the powers that be" have done: : everything legal, so I am assuming that they have: : raised the original land patents in their own name.: : This in order to cement the legal and lawful connection: : to the property tax (land rent) that they charge. In: : terms with municipalities involved in annexations,: : conducted under personal identifiable ballot, by the: : property owners of the affected area, some process: : must be involved after the annexation is completed,: : in order to transfer the taxing authority from the: : previous beneficiary to the new beneficiary. Perhaps: : this is done by the municipality raising the land patent: : in it's name, transferring it from the county. Perhaps: : everything is done de facto, i.e. the filing of a property: : tax return is admission that the government owns: : the property. A neighbor had a fence line dispute.: : Recalling a conversation from long ago, my neighbor: : was made aware of an original land grant by the city: : attorney (all this in an age prior to awareness).: : Everything else seems to be out in the open, ready for: : inspection and interpretation. Best place to hide: : grass (definitely vetch or clover) is in your lawn.: : How many property records searches are done with the: : municipality as the subject matter? I'll work on that: : one.: : Of course in the normal course of modern real estate: : transactions, the actual contract is never consummated: : for lack of consideration (no MONEY transferred), so the: : deed is worthless, and subject to challenge due to the: : failure of the contract. Payment of money (in hand paid): : has to accompany and be witnessed to cement the transaction.: : So without payment, the previous patent holder sits secure: : through the invalidity of contract.